BPM times in engine prime


#62

OK - I’ll throw the screenshots up, but not great actually, and perhaps something I haven’t picked up due to the music I’m using.

It does take the BPM in correctly from Serato, but then as soon as you load it in, it changes on the decks (stays the same in the selection window though until you click onto a new track).

Only suggestion I can make is that after MiK has put the BPM into the main column, then manually enter the BPM into Prime (pain of a workflow), but it does match the more accurate MiK readings from the outset.

Sorry about that @mufasa, pure coincidence then that it worked for me.


#63

Thanks for confirming that you do get the same result as myself and others.

Engine Prime is alright with straight 4/4 house/techno tracks, even if you don’t parse your tracks through MIK and Serato like you do it will get the BPM.

The issue is with other genre of music that is not house ie Hip Hop, R & B, Reggae, Afrobeats, Soca, Dancehall. It manages to get some right but fails with other.

Like i mentioned earlier i have two copies of 50 cent - In Da Club and it gives me the right value for one and wrong bpm value for the other.

My library is 63k songs deep, no way will i manually peruse each track to see if the BPM is correct. If i was just acquiring music and building my collection sure i may be able to keep an eye on individual tracks as i add them to the library, even that will be a slow painful process in this era of downloading many tracks per week.

Suffice to say…my Rider is unchanged :grimacing:

Options for the good guys at Denon

  • If new track contains BPM value in the ID Tag, Engine Prime should import it as such and should only analyse for location of downbeat. This should apply for both the players and the EP software.

  • To continue to Improve BPM algorithm on players and software

  • Allow a easier way to correct wrong BPM on both players and software. Not tap!

For the sake of science i will test the old Engine 1.5 to see how that performs

And we have a winner…1.5.2 gets the BPM spot on.


#64

You know that you can type in the correct BPM (if you know it) in the Engine Prime software, right? Unfortunately I can’t find a way to do that on the player, though.


#65

Yes I know.

Where do you start with a decent size library? In my case let’s say 10% is incorrect that’s 6400 tracks…that are scattered about in the library…


#66

In my case, I did it a playlist at a time but most of my music is techno & house. It took quite a bit longer to correct my DnB, Jungle, Disco, Soul and there’s still some playlists left to go. It’s certainly not optimal and I’ve chosen to hold off on some of my collection in the hopes that they “fix the glitch” but…


#67

Where does Engine Prime write it too (not in Engine, but in the ID tag). Does anyone know that? If you knew that, you could automate it on a mac from wherever MiK puts it, into the relevant tag.


#68

Engine Prime writes to its own Database I believe.


#69

I don’t mean that - it must write to the ID3 tag somewhere too, surely? Every other piece of music software utilises that - I’m going to have a play with some file over the weekend, see if I can figure it out.


#70

yes @mufasa is correct where all/most other DJ software are writing the BPM/KEY etc in the ID3tags Engine Prime does write these it’s own database.EP reads and shows the ID3tag data when a song is added newly to the collection and these ID3tags were there already, e.g. added by other software like MIK, Serate or Rekordbox.

However as soon you will analyse the song with Engine Prime, which you need if you want a beatgrid, then EP writes his own BPM/KEY info to the own EP database and will thus show the “new” data which can be diff/wrong to what was created by the other software.


#71

I’m currently working through the database files with an SQL programme but it doesn’t seem cut and dried with that either; the 50 cent track shows as 90 in the BPM of the database, but 123 when analysed through Prime, so where it is written too is anyone’s guess?!?!

I’m determined to crack this one though…


#72

It doesn’t change the key in mine, unless they are exactly the same as MiKs (see the images earlier).


#73

We need better bpm algorithm for this :sunglasses::sunglasses::sunglasses:


#74

I would rather see that the development team focus’s more on the “basic” requests from the users here, then adding a lot of nice to have things.


#75

Agree ! i really hope the next update are coming before the end of 2018 or big one for Namm 2019


#76

It’s not possible at the moment. Let’s hope they put it in the firmware soon.


#77

Its February 2019

I ve got BPMs all over the place with no easy way to fix them.

Just give us an option to shrink or expand the beat grid and that will help us correct the nonsense bpm we get.

Using a button combo

E.g

when in beat grid edit mode…holding shift + turning jog wheel Clockwise to Shrink (increase the bpm) Anticlockwise to Expand (decrease the bpm)

It needs to factor in the manually created down beat anchors i.e changes made after a manually created anchor should only affect the grids to the right of it.

Basically just implement it like Serato or Rekordboxdj beat grid edit.

This is basic fam…bpm is basic, fundamental.

Not pitch play, not resolume, not Soundswitch, not key match and whatever fluff they are coding in. I will classify them as nice to haves but totally not important. Hell all these need proper bpm to even work correctly.

Priorities Denon…Priorities!


#79

As the original poster of this thread 86 days ago of course I agree 100%! This is adding hours and frustration to preparing for my shows. And as I’ve mentioned I’m not even using Engine Prime to prepare my music which is its own level of frustrating. I’m literally dragging tracks straight to flash and inserting into players and going at it one track at a time. It’s a huge time suck and is detracting from how much I LOVE these machines.

But the bpm thing is getting harder and harder to ignore. It’s making me pour even more time into prep and I already spend a lot. And more sadly it’s making me just wanna grab a Serato controller because I know I just have to boot up Serato and it properly scans all of my new tracks in mere moments.

I keep hoping for these updates soon. We keep being told, “soon”.

I can’t stress enough, I LOVE these players and mixer. They are seriously a joy, hardware-wise. But the software stuff takes off HUGE points. The software side is INTEGRAL to this system.

I know the Denon guys are working hard on this. And I’m sure their user base has grown considerably with the price drops. But when you do lots of shows each week and you’re stressed out about something as simple as making updates to your music library, something is terribly wrong.

How in the world has this not been fixed in two years? It’s hitting me. Spending 3k was not a drop in the bucket for me but yikes if I’d paid 6k? You said it though.

Fundamentals.

I hope we get these updates soon and I hope they get rid of these barriers so we can all just get to focus on our craft.


#80

100 agree ! Denon and Engine prime must really catch up with rekordbox @Jay_DenonDJ


#81

Posting my method in case it helps anyone…

I open Traktor and EP side by side; I drag a file on to the player of EP and right from my EP list, I drag and drop the same music file on to Traktor. I see how Traktor analyses it and compare to EP and make my adjustments on EP. Some files that are wrong on both Traktor and EP, I use TAP on Traktor as it is absolutely solid and then I take that value and enter it for that track in EP. one thing I didn’t mention is when I have the BPM sorted, I adjust the grid if necessary. Hope this helps and if you have a faster solution pls let me know. If you do it my way, remember to unlock your decks in both EP and Traktor…Makes it easier to drag and drop the next track without having to stop the deck.


#82

Thanks for the input and help Shain! We are all super hopeful that a proper solution is coming from Denon, sooner rather than later. I feel like they have probably set the release date for the Prime 4 as their ‘gotta have it done’ timeframe or otherwise with sales of the Prime 4 almost guaranteed to be really good, these forums are gonna be a buzz in all of the worst ways that I know Denon doesn’t want.