Sampler and Hot Cue in the future

Engine DJ Hardware Media Players
21

If they denon had enough memory inside the prime to give some really basic sampler function it would tread on the toes of their sister company, Akai. So I think there will be any hurry, if any, to even think about adding a sampler to denon goods

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22

This discussion is just a reflection, whether it is possible, loose conversation. Would the sampler or hot cue function (jumps to the next tracks) be useful to you? Of course I say yes

You’re talking about a ram that would be needed for this. The topic is forward-looking. Maybe this can’t be done on the current prime series but denon may work in the future with new models for dji :slight_smile:

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23

This is a joke right?

Please, do us all a favour and educate yourself, I’ll even provide a link for you.

“RAM is orders of magnitude faster than an SSD”

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24

So no freebie sampler then. Makes sense when samplers cost hundreds or thousands of any currency and firmware is free. There had to be more to it than a few lines of free code.

Can this be topic be moved over to the “Will not implement” section then, as a sign for others, if they search.

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25

Indeed.

NVMe SSD comes close, but it will never be next to the cpu like RAM.

Intel Optane is probably the closest to [cpu <> memory] out there.

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26

Excuse me, but where did I say that SSD was the same speed as RAM?

Having trouble finding it? That’s because I never said that, so why on earth you’re linking to an article on the speed difference I have no idea.

Maybe it’s you that needs the education. Maybe you’re not aware that early hardware samplers had very little RAM, and that software based samplers can stream from the HDD rather than using RAM. From an article about NI Kontakt: “sample time on a hardware sampler was limited to the amount of onboard RAM. A computer was capable of streaming much longer samples from a hard drive.”

27

Not the same, but almost… But You must realize, that this is a big difference. Still hardware is needed to do it…

29

When you consider that a sampler costs hundreds, it makes sense that a few lines of code added to something that is already using its resources to do its primary job, isn’t going to give.

While we’re rubbing aladdins lamp, I want Latte Maker firmware updates on my SC5000, with milk frother :coffee:

…

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30

You’re wrong partly, and right a very little bit. From my time of working in repairs for the old Akai polyphonic samplers, like the S900,also Roland and Yamaha hear, I can maybe put this conversation to bed - that RAM, rather than hard drive, is &everything& when it comes to samplers.

Here how it worked - it used RAM and a hard drive:

Imagine an 8 button sampler - so eight separate samples, one on each pad, or a long sample split across the 8 pads.

Let us imagine on pad 1 we have a sample that, when triggered says “A B C D E F G H” and on sample pad 2 we’ve got a sample that says “I J K L M N O P” and on pad 3 there’s a sample that says “Q R S T U V W X”

RAM was the most expensive single chip on the PCB for computers and most other tech devices - it was like gold dust. Designers couldn’t just throw megabytes or gigabytes of RAM into a design.

So what RAM was on the device was split between the pads and stored the first 1024 milliseconds of the sample, so on pad 1 the RAM would store “A B” only, not “A B C D E F G H”. The device relied on the sampler being able to pull “…C D E F G H” from the hard drive and the device “stitched” the hard drives “C D E F G H” seamlessly onto the end of the RAMs “A B…”

Pad 2’s RAM would only store “I J” with “K L M N O P” being quickly pulled off of the hard drive and “stitched”

And so on for Pads 3 thru 8 This is a form of page swapping, used by most desktop/home computers today.

This is how Denon Hot Cues worked on their CD deck Hot Starts too for the D9000, D2500, D5500.

The prime 5000 has a decent amount of RAM in it, going by a chip count, but when you think that it loads a whole track into memory, on two layers , there’s very little RAM left for any other tasks.

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31

Tremendous explanations, you are fabulous.

Simply put, it’s hardware wasn’t designed for SAMPLE, it’s simple and straightforward.

I still have the denon dns3500, which have an integrated sampler, and you must have been really able to use it for multiple reasons, one of them was that the output of the sampler was the same as that of the CD you were playing, which produced a double gain in decibels, for this is the reason you must adapt the hardware to be able to add this feature (also the software). In this case, denon should take this into account when launching the DENON PRIME 4 II+ MK3. :rofl:

In short, they are not made for that. I do not complicate, for PRIME 4 and SC5000 what I do is that I have a Sample CREATE within the database, where I have standardized tracks in different pre-established BPM. I do this when I have timed show’s, where I have to meet a schedule. So I dedicate only one channel for this purpose.

When I have shows where I’m going to do freestyle djing and I want to get creative, I use one of my external samplers. I have a Roland SP-404 and a Korg KP3+, that is my favorite. :v:

32

how do you rename cue points in EP on mac as it does not have the right click option.

33

Double click

34

Thanks i will give that a go

35

The sampler option is a must whilst the effects for the x1850 are nice for type of music i play they do not fit unless Denon can make a rounded set of effects e.g horns, sirens, glass breaks, explosions etc when you’re playing dancehall, reggae soca, flanger does not quite do it. Denon if you could create those effects as described in your future updates you will continue to have my business, you got me with the hardware see to it you keep me interested.

36

The workaround is to cut your effects into 1 track using some audio software (audacity etc) then set hot cues for each effect and load it on a spare deck.

I for one am against integrating such crappy effects like horn, siren and glass into the mixer, those effects are overused, annoying and just utter garbage.

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37

My 1980s sound fx key ring used to do those so well, and “machine gun”, “whistling rocket” and “grenade”

)))) BOOM (((( <<<<

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38

What you need is this wonderfully cliche Gemini PMX2500 mixer from the days of Horn, glass break , etc

image
image1242×1808 1.02 MB

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39

It depends where the samples are sourced, playing music is one thing but the extra effects if of good quality and used sparingly add a touch more atmosphere.

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40

I hear you man, I am dancehall reggae DJ in the main i on my pioneer gear i am fully stocked but I cannot deny Denon is going in I just want them to add some extra effects to cover the genres I play.

41

Be original. If you really can’t be applauded or win battles or a pat on the back without doing what everyone else playing the same genre is playing to link tracks or cover silent breaks and breakdowns then be original in / how \ you play that horn (please don’t tell me it’s the air horn sound with 3 or 4 false starts/stutter starts on it.

Make a new track, just 30 seconds of silence in audicty or similar program, cut and paste your 6 or 8 favourite old skool sound effects onto the 30 second track, with a few seconds between each one. When you load the track into a spare layer switch the pitch ranger up to + - 100% and switch key lock OFF … now stutter the effects from that track, using the performance pads, at the same time as playing the pitch slider control like a trombone or slide whistle

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