Firmware update thoughts

Just to clarify a bit. I think there are expectations of updates and things being added to our Prime setups due to those things being promised and talked about in multiple videos by Denon themselves. Speaking for myself that’s where it came from with me. I kinda felt like I was buying into something cutting edge that would be updated and kept feeling that way. It hasn’t. But. Saying that.

The system is solid for me minus the weird tempo change when starting a layered track on the same device which I’ve mentioned here.

And of course the Engine Prime software itself. Which has been addressed with a dedicated team now so hopefully things are coming there.

So I’m going back into quiet mode and hopefully things happen and if they don’t, it is what it is.

The jog is a mechanical component that registers data and goes through software. Sensitivity to movement is a software thing and can be mediated with simple divisors or multipliers… it almost certainly already is being mediated that way.

I’m with you on this brother - I bought them and loved them out of the box, they are better than anything I’ve ever had my hands on. Can they be improved, of course they can, but it doesn’t impact on what a great piece of kit they are.

I get the BPM thing, I’m not a hip hop/open format DJ so it doesn’t affect me. High end roll off, I’m 42, my ears don’t hear it. The effects are ripe for improving, but I can mix for hours without using them and it doesn’t impact on my experience, or that of the punters listening to me.

I certainly wouldn’t swap them for CDJs…

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I hope I get to enjoy it the same way as you are soon.

Its just the BPM thing left for me even as an open format DJ.

I do hope higher management is already aware of this, it would be a shame if higher management has to be made aware by its employees what the customer experience is……

We are not expecting an overnight firmware update, 1 update every 2-4 months, specially with firmware/software that is build from scratch, would be appreciated.

In my opinion this would be a valid statement if there would be more regular updates, in this case we are waiting for months for an update. I don’t think it is fair to say, just have a bit more patience…

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Hi everyone.

Well, this is quite the thread. 120 posts and counting. Firstly, apologies for a delayed reply from myself, and thanks @Chloe_DENONDJ for chiming in earlier. So I see the tonality is in a mixed bag of directions, concerns, frustrations, sarcasm, wit, humour, support and digs, encouragement and deprecation but hey, this is the platform after all for you to have your say - and it’s up to us to listen, absorb and react to the benefit of all members and customers alike. I’ve read through every post, noted as many concerns as can be logically and realistically responded to and will address them individually or grouped (deep breath!)…

’Regular Updates’ - As has been mentioned, software development teams work in Sprints. For these sectionalised periods within a year the teams have certain job allocations and tasks which are carefully planned beforehand then scheduled into the next upcoming sprint. New feature additions can be integrated, but they could affect or even ‘break’ other already solid, trusted and needed features so there is a roll back to repair then a forward movement again once all is looking good. It’s not wise to push out added features, fixes or improvements in a rushed manner. These things take time to test and fully regress, still making sure the new doesn’t break the old, so putting our user’s experience at risk. The latter is the last thing on our minds.

This is where our Forum members here (and of course some in this thread already are a part of this) may wish to consider joining our Beta Testing group. We’d encourage recruiting trusted individuals who are willing to test and try out firmware and software updates (in advance of release candidates) under a solid NDA capacity, than spend what precious time they have going backward and forward in threads which escalate like these. Please could you guys respond below if you feel you’d have the time to dedicate to that scenario so we can gauge interest for a further run of Beta Tester recruitment? This way, ‘you’ become part of the development story even further and with an additionally strengthened voice. Let us help you, help us and help everyone else who’s passionate about their investment in Denon DJ products and the future of the brand!

’High End Roll Off’ - You guys have been extremely vocal about this and for that we thank you and have listened. This has been improved in the high frequency response and will be available in the next FW update for the SC5000/M.

’Pitch Resolution’ - Again, noted and addressed. Pitch resolution will move back to a higher resolution and available in the next FW update

’Search Comments’ - available in the next FW update (and before you all ask… no I can’t give the exact date of this ‘next’ fw update, but I can say it is coming optimistically sooner than later).

’Too much focus on Prime 4’ - Naturally, the Dev team have recently been hugely focused on Prime 4 and their hard work was reflected in the highly (and on-going) positive response from the DJ community globally. However, pretty much any feature addition or workflow/performance improvement evident in Prime 4, is part of the main Engine Prime ecosystem of software - ultimately then, the SC5000 and SC5000M plus any future products bearing the ‘Prime’ badge, all benefit - as do customers who own the varying products. For example, the on-screen crate/playlist editing/management, realtime pitch-shifting and comment searching (see above) will all arrive in the next SC5000/M update.

As a rather large PS to the Denon DJ commitment to Engine Prime software (and associated hardware FW) development, some of you may have heard or read about our CEO’s recent investment into a new, dedicated tech/dev team, office and manpower over in Auckland, New Zealand. If not, you can read about that by clicking this link. This new tech facility has had a $10 million investment and the entire development team there is focused exclusively on DJ related software. This means, to you guys as our valued Forum members and customers/end-users globally, that software development, feature improvements, new innovations and technologies will be forthcoming at a very encouraging rate and frequency. In addition, inMusic has associated and connected Dev teams in the UK and Europe too (with our main Product Teams based in the US), all servicing ‘DJ’ products in various capacities. So, hopefully you’ll see, our foot is firmly on the gas and we are committed incredibly to offering the DJ world the best, most creatively effective DJ instruments for their performance work.

’Traktor HID’ - We have a good connection with the NI team and as all of you know, have together brought Traktor import into the Engine Prime workflow. No doubt the NI team have been focused largely last year on their new range of DJ/Studio products, and they too work in sprints, so we’d hope to continue working with them more this year on additional collaborative projects to meet the requests for HID/mixer certification etc.

’Build quality not as good as a CDJ’ - Without getting into a ‘I beg to differ’ conversation with that member, I’ll just state that of course we have the highest standards of robust build quality, metal chassis’, durability, reliability and overall quality control that was birthed with the genesis of Denon DJ, and inMusic continues to this day. My confidence in that statement is unequivocal.

The member who mentions ‘no repair parts are available’ or suggest they are costly anyway compared to our main competitor, again I’ll direct any requirements for repairs, parts, service or other product assistance to our frankly world-class Customer Support teams. Just ask for what you need on this Forum - it’s one of the reasons it’s here, and we have official eyes-on to best help you.

’X1800 Mixer FW Update’ - Correct, there has been only one major fw update for the X1800. I’m pleased to say however that another is approaching, and at a similar timeline rate as the above mentioned updates to the SC5000/M. You can look forward to some great improvements to the OLED screen usage, additional visual feedback elements and audio workflow improvements to name but a few.

‘Engine Prime’ - well, this is a thread about firmware updates, but (and the Beta Tester members viewing this already have an in depth heads up), we have some fantastic workflow, speed and efficiency improvements coming… and yes, soon too.

’Beat Grid Accuracy’ - this is something that is in continual development for improvement. Hopefully, all on this thread have the latest public release version installed on the Engine Prime librarian software (you do, right?) and of course the on-board analysis capabilities of the hardware (SC5000/M/Prime 4) are also effective (and to remind all, unavailable on any other standalone DJ product). The requests/demands for ‘flexible’ beat-grids hasn’t been ignored, as too we’ve acknowledged the sector of DJs who want a wider range of BPM analysis (at faster, drum 'n bass + tempo’s etc) - we’re listening!

Ok, so I hope this rather extended response has answered some of your questions, addressed some of your concerns and reassured all that we are here, we are working hard for you all and are totally committed to improving and enhancing how you work, play and perform with the choice and investment you’ve made in our products. We’re wholly passionate about them and glad you are too, but let’s try and keep Forum threads on-topic, constructive, non-personal and gather a strength of communication between us and your fellow members here that shows this as a truly world class DJ community who care the biggest damn for their art!

Best wishes

Paul

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Awesome respons @paul_denondj :raised_hands: This is the kind of respons/ info once in a while, I’ve been asking for the last 2.5 years - it just puts some faith back.

So thank you!

And I would love to spend time being a Beta-tester for the SC5000 / X-1800 / EP.

Thanks again!

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Thanks so much for the update.

I’d also could and like participate as a beta tester.

Woah thank you @paul_denondj for everything in this thread !

Sorry for the part about the build quality I have no problem with my SC5000, I just saw some people with build quality problem lately and It scared me about the durability of the product

Same thing about the repair parts we tend to try to compare with competitors like pioneer or other :slight_smile:

This message from you was really important and I’m glad the denon team is listening to us

Thank you Paul, Your response is exactly what we needed to hear. Looking forward to the updates and the future of these products! Very exciting

Paul!!! Thank you!!! THIS is what I’m talking about!!! So much appreciation for your post here and it means SO MUCH!!!

I can’t express how much good will you have spread with this one post.

Thank you again and I would be HAPPY to be a beta tester, especially on the Engine Prime side of things! Anything at all I can do to help I would love and be happy to, so please contact me!

Thank you so, so much Paul!

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As others have stated, thanks so much Paul. This kind of post every quarter or so goes a long way to assuage any doubts an “old school” Denon owner might have. (Owns: DN2500F, 2x DN-SC2000, 2x DN-SC2900, X1700 & 2x SC5000). I, too, would be very interested in Beta testing anything SC5000 or Engine Prime. Still holding off on pulling the trigger on the X1800 as I still LOVE the sound of my X1700.

@paul_denondj Thank you for this wonderful post! This kind of communication is not something that is usually seen from product manufacturers regarding development processes. It is extremely encouraging to see and to be frank, a huge breath of fresh air. So thank you! Very excited to see whats coming :slight_smile:

Coming from a QA background and as a SC5000/M, X1800 owner, I would most definitely be interested in participating in a beta test program. :+1:

Thanks Paul, there were many people on this thread that for some reason needed this reassurance and it’s easy to tell you’ve made them happy, for now. There are others however who have used Denon products for 30+ years quite simply because they are the best. We don’t need to be told this, we already know. I began my career with Denon and I will end it with Denon all the while knowing I’m using the best gear I can be, backed by a fantastic team of people who are doing their best to make it the best possible experience. Yes there are bumps in the road, nothing is perfect, but I know there are people working on smoothing the bumps, I don’t need to be reminded, it’s what I’ve learned over my 30 years with Denon. I suspect that Prime 4 will be my last console before I retire and it looks like it’s going to be a hell of a way to close out my career! Believe in the products guys, Denon knows what they’re doing and always has!

thanks Paul! Exactly that what we needed :ok_hand:

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Superb @paul_denondj, we might actually get back to some discussions on this forum instead of constant gripes about the best piece of DJ kit that is out there!!!

Put me down for Beta testing btw!!

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Hi Paul,

Thanks for the reply. This is the intent of my original post. … Some clarification from denon about our beloved products and some encouragement to be more open on status etc.

Nice to see your development is going on an agile path. Being a scrum master myselve I can only encourage this. By the way we work in two week sprints. For us, both in hardware and software, this is considered to be the ideal time frame for our teams

If you would consider me in the beta test program, this would be appreciated. I did some beta testing on traktor for NI in the past. Of course the mentioned NDA is no prob.

Thanks again.

Hi Paul

I would be very interested in joining the beta program - I have a prime setup as my home setup so would have no problem in finding the time to test beta firmware.

NDA’s are also not a problem for me - I’m a software developer in my day job so most everything I do is under NDA of some sort :slightly_smiling_face:

Regards, Jon

like to join the beta programm too… complete Prime Setup here :wink:

thanks an all the best,

regards Roland

I would like to be on the betatestteam too! I m on 2xsc5k + x1800

And thanks so much for your elaborate respons to all our questions and concerns. Much much apreciated Paul!!