Engine Prime filename & path bugs


#1

I have managed to break Engine Prime several times due to slashes in path names, exotic characters in filenames and in one case with an id3 tag.

In some cases this caused the engine prime database to become corrupted (or so it seemed) in other cases this stops the export of files to external media.

If somebody technical wants to get in touch I would be more than happy to discuss how to recreate these issues.

This likely just boils down the string sanitation needing to be more robust.


#3

I asked a similar question about a month back but never got a response - though it did motivate me to finally get more focused (insane) about being more consistent with id3 tagging of my digital library. I started using kid fr metadata, the FAT32 allowed character sets (etc) making sure all my file names conformed, and making sure I had the metadata structured id3v2.4.0 style (a simple thing to do with kid3 or similar software). My guess is that you violated some FAT32 character restriction(?) because pretty much the same thing happened to me.

My advice to the world today: clean your metadata up (then backup) BEFORE dumping it all into EP, Serato, etc.


#4

You are completely right. Engine Prime’s parsing of filenames and id3 tag’s is shockingly bad and stops the program from functioning correctly. I was totally psyched up ready to buy the new Prime 4 controller but first I spent a day wrestling with Engine Prime software just trying to get some of my collection onto a HD in order to try out in the shop before buying.

What I found has completely put me off and I am now not even considering buying any Denon gear as this is a complete joke. Every other mp3 player software and DJ software manages these files just fine but with Denon its a different story.

Whats even more madednin is that I’m a programmer and I wrote an mp3 & video player years back and had to do all of this and even I managed to get that right… and that was over ten years ago.

Denon, pull your socks up… your software is a joke.


#5

Weird. So my reply to you @logik1 was written seven days ago…and it got flagged by system for some reason (it contained a link I think). I see that it was now ‘posted’ 11 hours ago without said link and missing some content (ie. right around "kid fr’ ). Anyway, just because I’m curious - and also deciding on whether to jump deeper into the Prime-verse or not (I still own a pioneer setup and only one sc5000) - what is an example or two of character issues you’re having?


#6

I did wonder what on earth “kid fr” was as googling that didn’t turn up any mp3 tag editor :wink:

Off the top of my head I had one file with a tilde in it and another with an Umlaut. These either stopped the files from being analysed or synced or both (Can’t remember now)

As well as this I have at least a hundred or so files that analyse fine but will not export to an external drive… I tried completely removing the mp3 tag on one of these and that ‘fixed’ it and it would then sync to external media.

This is nothing new it seems. There’s a YouTube video here showing two files that are not decoding properly and cause other issues.

MP3 parsing and ID3 tags are a minefield as there are programs out there that do ‘weird none standard stuff’ … Simply testing your software against mp3’s downloaded from Beatport and Trax Source is not good enough… It needs to be tested against any and all files you can find that will have been encoded with ‘who knows what’ encoder and will give your mp3 parser a real hard time and your programmers many headaches.

As it stands I made it fall over with the most trivial of stuff so I can’t be alone here. The only difference is ive got a slight advantage in that I know whats going on under the hood and know what the likely causes are (Unexpected characters in filenames, possibly in mp3 tags and parsing bugs in the mp3 decoder that can’t deal with non standard or corrupted data elegantly)


#7

It’s kinda a troubleshooting 101 stuff when somebody complains online about any DJ program not functioning properly with a certain file: remove weird characters from filename and remove the id3 tag. I don’t think Denon deserves extra flak about that (considering all of the other stuff that’s missing in EP)


#8

This is basic functionality. Massive parts of my collection cause playlists to not sync. The only reason I’ve figured out which files are causing it is because I manually went through dropping in 100 at a time and syncing until I saw that the file count didn’t match. At no point does it error with “Oh look, this file is causing problems” it just silently falls on its arse.

If you were going to a gig, prepped your playlist and hit sync to usb stick, got to the gig and found half your set was missing you would be might ■■■■■■? right?

It should not be down to the user to figure this stuff out. This is programming 101. Sanitise your data input, provide meaningful error dialogs… In fact… there should be no need for error dialogs as Rekordbox, Traktor, VLC, Windows Media Player, Foobar 2000, Serato, Virtual DJ, Mixxx and no doubt some other random DJ program I’ve forgotten about all manage these files just fine… Yet Engine Prime falls on its arse.

This software is “Not fit for purpose” in the UK and Europe in that it fails to do the function its advertised for sale as.


#9

Watch out, we have a programmer over here. It’s a free software. Calm your tatas.

It takes 15min for average user to figure out that the EP is not on the same level as other softwares that had 10+yr headstart.

It’s great that you reported one more flaw. But outrage? Lol

Anyway, can’t you just use Rekordbox?


#10

Its free software that drives gear with a £1500 price tag… that doesn’t work properly.

I’m no longer considering a Prime 4 and I’ve spent my money on some Traktor gear instead.

I’m done here :wink:


#11

I would like to believe you. Let us know if you find any other fatal flaws :wink:


#12

I’ll revist in a year maybe to see if things have improved :wink:


#13

This post was flagged by the community and is temporarily hidden.


#14

If Engine Prime software worked I would buy a Prime 4 at the drop of a hat, it looks like an XDJ beater in every way… The touch screen really makes it and an internal HD is just a genious idea.

As it stands all I had were problems syncing just part of my collection.

As well as these random files not syncing the software would also produce duplicates in weird ways… I took videos of that actually which I can post.

I was just trying to prep an external SSD to take up to the local shop to try out and all that happened was I lost a day with files not syncing and general “weird stuff” happening which was enough to put me off.

Other than these weird problems the Engine Prime software seemed pretty basic but functional… it just needs some TLC to get things right… I did some more digging and found other people with similar problems which has just made me want to walk away and wait it out.

Worst case scenario is I’ll pick one up second hand on eBay in a year and run some sort of id3 tag cleaning software through my collection but as it stands im not willing to fork out £1500 thats backed by software which constantly failed and caused me a days worth of headaches over what should have been the simplest of things.


#15

@logik1 In similar posts to this one (ie. people intelligently laying out their issue(s) with EP), the official Denon DJ personal (and not just overly ‘helpful’ forum members) have fairly consistent in noting that 1) yes, they do see the issue/problem described in the post, 2) they are documenting it and sending it up the chain, & 3) the recently hired (or announced?) dev team - whose sole focus is EP - will make things better. I think you’re right to hold off purchasing anything from Denon DJ right now - my sc5000 has been living in its decksaver for a few weeks no because I can’t get the EP to do what I need and that rekordbox can do. It’s also a total ■■■■■■ [whats up with the word b u m m e r being censored here?] because the general ‘feel’ of the sc5000 (and Prime 4 presumably) are just so much more ‘solid’ (or whatever) than Pioneer. I had my cd-2000nxs2s set with with the sc5000 and its more than just a superficial feeling. Even simple scratching is vastly more enjoyable on an sc5000 platter than a plastic feeling/sounding/responding nxs2. But the fact that Denon recognizes existing problems (something the Pioneer DJ forum absolutely will not in terms of their own issues), has beefed up their EP dev team, and have taken time to respond personally and individually MUST be a good sign (I hope). I just hope instead of reinventing the wheel, EP becomes a totally stable, totally efficient tool for interfacing tracks with machines - opposed to some traktor/rb/serato knockoff (as many have pointed out in defense of Denon "everyone else has had a 10+ year head start in software dev here) . Let’s hope Denon uses that fact to their advantage.


#16

There will presumably be a new version of EP software when the Prime 4 lands to cater for the new device ID and any new features that needs from the software side of things… So I guess worth checking back when that lands. For now I’ve gone the Traktor route and I will probably sell my XDJ RX … Even though it is pretty good the small screen and pain of searching is now getting right on my wick… I can never navigate to a file I want in good time as the search on that is diabolical. Plus its only two channels and I am yearning for more inputs.