Corrupt SSD in middle of set on Prime 4

I was in the middle of playing a practice set (not live - THANK THE FSM!), when I was scrolling for the next song to play when the database corrupted message pops up. Music is still playing on decks 1 and 2, but for some reason it just pooped out on me.

The SSD can be read fine by my pc, it has no corrupted clusters, etc… All the files are intact.

What’s the issue here? I was planning on taking this out to play a very small party with some friends in a couple of weeks. I purchased my P4 back in March, so I’m most likely outside the return policy date from my music dealer, so probably out of luck there.

The SSD is a 500GB Samsung Evo 860. I have 461GB of free space.

My Prime 4 is on firmware 1.4.1

I’ve seen other issues with corrupted flash drives on the forums, but not the internal disk. Does anyone have similar experiences? Can I safely gig with this thing?

Is the ssd ExFAT or FAT32 formated?

It’s a shame that it happened , whatever “it” is.

But a distant diagnosis, somehow pinpointing how one ssd, inside one prime 4, at one practice session, got one error, is somewhat unlikely. Especially when thousands of other Prime 4s aren’t giving the same behaviour.

Any storage device can fail, at any time, in any situation.

The moral can only be “be prepared” and the solution can only be, have a backup - the same solution for any other gear: Play using stylus’s? Carry spare stylus’s. Play using CDs? Carry spare CDs l? Play using hard drive? Carry a spare hard drive.

Shame it happens, but it happens

I’m just wondering - if this were to happen, is it possible to switch over to Tidal (or the others when we do eventually get them) and use that, with a “corrupt” database on the drive?

So here’s the weird thing - after rebooting my Prime 4, I can still use the disk. My PC still reads the disk. The Engine Prime software on my PC still says the drive is corrupt. I have analyzed the disk - the disk is not corrupt. Not a single segment is corrupt.

I’m a software developer. This is clearly an edge case - but that is why we create unit tests and program for fault tolerance. This is bad software. Hands down. Not happy with this.

@DjEric - Disk is ExFAT formatted as it is over 32GB. I know you can work around the limitation, but it is not a desired state. ExFAT is my preferred format for any non-system drives as it is less susceptible to corruption.

Pics for reference - one is from Prime Engine software and one is from the Error Checking tool found in the properties context menu => tools tab area of windows file explorer. corrupt drive|690x288

I think the error message is poorly worded. Denon should change “the drive is corrupt” to “the database on the drive is corrupt”

For streaming services separate databases are used.

ExFAT with MBR layout is the right one for the Primes. Do you eject the SSD safely when in computer USB mode? Then again, it could all be a USB chipset compatibility thing.

Yeah I agree with that. One member even thought he should reformat his c-drive as exFAT because of this message.

So I was playing, not connected to my PC, just my audio interface which was in pass-though mode when I received the error message. What’s the point of having an internal drive bay if the “database” can be corrupted mid-set? I’m not hating, but it is somewhat alarming.

Can it also be stated that we shouldn’t be beta-testing software over a year into full release.

That’s why you need a backup on sdcard inside your P4 just in case.

Be careful of ssd drives which could have some random read errors (use Samsung, very good ssd drives)

It’s good though that it’s possible to switch and use Tidal if the database becomes unusable (assuming Reese’s answer was a yes).

In situations like this, I’d rather have a laptop on standby than just an SD card or another drive.

What if the whole unit died (PSU failure)? With a laptop and a simple cable you can connect to your audio system and use your DJ software.

But the whole point of these standalone controllers is to leave the laptop at home. Therefore the reliability of the units and their software should be as close to 100 percent as possible. Denon are way off from that.

Having had a MCX8000 die in the middle of a gig due to main board failure I’m a bit sceptical now. If I hadn’t had my laptop wired up the gig would have been ruined.

Not so much to leave the laptop at home, but to function without needing a laptop connected. To be a “smart” playback device, not a “dumb” controller which does nothing without the “brains” (laptop).

It does meet those criteria. The laptop is the backup device. It’s not needed to make the Prime unit function.

I could just as easily have said “I’d rather have a tablet on standby”, or an iPod, or even a CD player. The point being, if your main device fails then you have something to fall back on.

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Ok, but if P4 died during a gig, even if you have notebooks with VDJ, what do you do? Or do you start VDJ in automatic mix, or don’t you think of ending the party using the keyboard to mix? At that point if you want a complete backup system you should also have a small console to connect to your notebook.

I do have small hardware that I can use with the laptop if necessary. I just wasn’t clogging up the post by mentioning everything I have!

I think the Prime 4 is very versatile, having internal HDD, then SD and USB slots should that fail, then streaming, then external analogue inputs on the mixer, then use with laptop and DJ software…

Lots of options.

This is a reason for me to have SC5000 pair and x1800 as my main play system, but to have the prime 4 as my backup.

My Laptop is a household device, and so stays at my household, it doesn’t go out, it runs Engine Prime at home for adding new analyses music to my three same harddrives. I don’t have and internal drive installed in the prime 4, I plug in an external.

I don’t bring my Philips HiFi from my house to my party’s to act for monitor speakers, I don’t bring my home laptop out either. I see both of those as consumer domestic things not pro or prosumer. I’m pleased denon is moving it’s newer products away from laptop dependence now that the technology is there to do that.

All the primes can fail as much as any other hardware thing can. But For me a laptop has too many parts that can fail.

I also take three hard drives to parties. They are all almost identical for their contents.

Yes, because you probably bought it from a “household” retailer. Rugged laptops do exist, if you choose to purchase one. Just not from your local store.

I have a protective sleeve for my laptop. I also have a solid case with foam inside. Recently I changed the internal drive for SSD so now it’s more secure against vibration/impact.

I have been taking computers to gigs for many years now, and have never damaged one.

It’s not the outsides of laptops that make me think they’re best kept away from live environments

Well in that case, your SC5000s and your X1800 should also not leave your house. They too have “computers” inside. Processor, memory, operating system…

That is an utterly ridiculous statement. As PK says laptops can also be used professionally. Maybe your one is £249 from Currys and wouldn’t be capable of playing music anyway…

Given the amount of SC players with black screens, dead X1850 mixers and Prime 4 units with peripherals not coming online I know what I’d rather take a chance with.

It’s more the case that we can be sure that with the Sc the only things that are going to change it’s performance or behaviour are the user data preferences which i can choose to load, or not, whenever I plug in a drive or stick, and the firmware.

Nothing’s getting twisted behind the scenes by other programs, or device driver updates or os upgrades.

My i7 laptop shares its volatile stability with any laptop from £199 to £3000+ in that OS changes, drivers etc can update behind the scenes and change how, or if, it works.

Of course, some of those updates can be turned off, but Microsoft are gradually making it more and more difficult to turn off auto updates.

Still, everyone can have their own opinions about what they feel secure about, and what they think is not secure enough for their purposes.